Transcript for "Joy - with Jayne Heggen"

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00:00.00 podcomm Hello I’m Craig Konine Janey Thanks for joining me. It’s always a little bit of a delight and excited like oh good somebody said yes I spend a lot of time asking people hey would you like to maybe you know and then but people say yes I always get excited.

00:01.58 jayne heggen Hello Correct I’m Janey hagin.

00:19.87 podcomm So I appreciate you taking the time out of your day to sit down. Sit still relatively still talk to me for twenty minutes what um so a lot of times I just say to people podcasting and then just see what they say in response to that and you immediately became effusive and ebullient about Joy. And I can see that it’s clearly something that brings you joy and so my my immediate fall of question to that was well no wait. So clearly you have this superpower and and it’s kind of like if you ever saw the tv show back in the eighty s called the greatest american hero I had a guy who had a superpower suit. From aliens but it didn’t come with a manual so it did all kinds of things he could like you know fly and all this super stuff. It was bulletproof but he didn’t know how to work it so he spent a lot of time running and jumping and falling on his face because he couldn’t make it fly greatest american hero classic eighty s junk television but I had this flash image of. You playing with all of these different superpowers that you they’re they’re like readily available like once you install the software. Well I can move things around I can I can change I can remove I can edit and ah my followup question when you said joy was well did you. Discover that joy first or have you had these superpowers in other places and that led you to tell me about broadcast work and I’m wondering if you could go back and tell yourself you know when you’re Mutson around at the college radio station hey 1 day. Going to be a famous podcaster. Would you have believed yourself if you had told yourself that can you can you imagine that janey believing that it would be as easy as it is to record edit publish take it down put it back up change it what what do you? think your thoughts would have been back then if you. Had seen where you were going to be now.

02:16.83 jayne heggen Well interesting thing about that is the word podcaster did not exist when I was in radio so I could not have asked myself that question. Ah, um, but being an on air talent in radio.

02:22.65 podcomm Right name.

02:35.43 jayne heggen But something I did toy with I really liked the mic I really liked speaking into the mic and just saying whatever I wanted to back then it wasn’t as easy for people to call in so really’s a 1 ne-way street ah

02:51.56 podcomm Yeah, and the phone went but time sh.

02:54.95 jayne heggen Yeah, exactly exactly. So I mean you know not quite that old. But even.

03:01.24 podcomm Hey I rotary phones when I grow up they’re not that far back anyway.

03:04.58 jayne heggen I Know so but you know it it was it was It was fun. It was um, you had an audience you didn’t know anything really ah about them and they’re kind of yours for the taking So you. Wanted to be respectful because they could call into your management and complain that that did happen. There was a way for them to get to you if they didn’t like you? Um, but yeah, how do you respect that people are listening to you? How do you say something that is important to you.

03:24.65 podcomm Um.

03:40.15 jayne heggen Maybe not to them but in a way that they may go Well yeah, that’s that’s a thought that’s an idea or yeah I’d like that. Um and just let you keep going So 1 sided because that’s kind of how it was all set up way back Then what’s wonderful about this… It’s It’s 2 sided so it’s where both. Telling a story and how do we come together now to craft a story together which is a podcast.

04:07.91 podcomm I Think there’s something magical about the number 2 Um I was just reading Well actually I was listening to a podcast which that I transcribed part of to write my thoughts down a little post about blah blah Blah blah and this person that I was listening to was talking about how people tend to form up in Dads. Use a diminutive word when a giant wom will suffice um and she was talking about if you go into like you know, walk into a party remember the days when you could do that walk into a party and people will be in little groups and her suggestion was if you want to be comfortable in those groups if you if you need to force yourself find an odd number because when you join a group of 3 or 5.

04:28.64 jayne heggen Um.

04:33.99 jayne heggen Is.

04:47.65 podcomm You’re giving the odd numbered person someone to pair with and it it just like clicked in my mind so they originally were talking about community building but that just that idea of pairings and how that is often what we are. You know you’re doing and what I’m doing in our shows that I think there’s magic in that and. I won’t go so far as to be believe you their metaphor of like we have 2 eyes. You know it’s like yes, but they both point in the same direction. So you’re looking at 1 verse and with Bob you know and I just wonder if you’ve had a chance yet to experiment with host on mic material. You know, just like trying to create something yourself I see a lot of people do that. And a lot of people. Do it really? Well and I can’t do it at all. So I’m wondering if you’ve if you’ve experimented with host on mic in podcasting after you’ve done it so much. Um, in radio I mean and you know that’s a long time ago I’m guessing but you definitely have been in the rabbit hole of 1 way host on mic. Literally where we get. The term is from radio. Um have you tried to experiment with that in podcasting have you found it easier or harder than 2 people.

05:46.99 jayne heggen What.

05:53.80 jayne heggen Well, it was a quandary which way do I go since I’m learning everything and and I I love the technology I’m just I geek out on it. Um I just felt right now it was more challenging to do 2 to actually speak with someone because that’s engagement and to have a really successful podcast. You could have a q and a session I’ve seen those ah you could have other sessions which I don’t understand but 2 people are on 2 people on a mic so there you go or you can have this. Engagement where there’s this is a connection a surprising connection and you go down this path of a conversation where you’re actually sharing something that’s where I decided to play and that’s harder because that means I had to be incredibly vulnerable. The person on their side has to be vulnerable and since I’m setting up the podcast. How can I help them because if we can’t get to that space then it’s a q and a and that has less information so that has a value but it’s who’s gonna who’s gonna listen to that Often. Ah.

06:55.85 podcomm Right.

07:04.69 podcomm Well even Beyond who’s going to listen to it somebody would listen to it but the question is why would I want to make a thing that I don’t want to listen to or a thing that doesn’t in some way scratch an itch I always say I don’t actually listen to my own work very much. It’s not something I’m comfortable doing but i.

07:05.43 jayne heggen Not many. A. Better yet.

07:23.54 podcomm I definitely don’t want to bother making things that don’t interest me like I don’t want to do? Um, I’ve done a couple of like panel discussions where I’m the moderator from multiple people and that’s not in my book. Fun. That’s a lot of work so that’s not something that i. I like ooh I raise and volunteer for that raise my hand and volunteer. What about Um, so there’s like sometimes Craig pauses and people like did the video lockup. It’s like no I’m just thinking I’m wondering what led you to talk. Ah, what led you to focus on Mentors. So your your podcast is talking about and talking with mentors and I’m wondering. Is there something about audio and mentors because I’m guessing that getting mentors into an intimate space. Would tend to be very fertile ground like if you randomly if I randomly grab people because I’ve tried this, you don’t get good tape the the average random selection of a person is not necessarily a good conversation partner but I’m wondering um where you. Were you mindful of how good mentors I’m guessing could really be as partners on these conversations or were you drawn to the topic of mentoring and then ah of course we’re going to bring mentors on the show.

08:44.68 jayne heggen Well mentoring is another life passion I’ve been a mentor for over 20 years I was trained to be a mentor and and it is a skill set. It’s like people get trained and certified be coaches. We hear that more often than Mentors. Ah. Because mentorship for so long was kind of encapsuled within a company. You had a mentor at your on your job and is is broader than that but that still is ah a chunk of it. What mentoring does is it tells stories about. Solutions which is way different from coaching which is asking questions to get to solutions which is different from counseling which is you’re asking questions to get to problems so you’ve got this whole problem solution thing. You got this asked tell mentors about telling. It’s sharing an experience and when you have a mentee who is on a path of his career or otherwise as they go down these paths. They’re going to run it up into obstacles or as a mentor you’re going to see. There’s an obstacle coming your way. Do you see this. Let me tell you this is here or.

09:45.55 podcomm Excuse. Um.

10:01.21 jayne heggen Um, you ran straight into that tree that was laying in the road. Okay, let’s back up. How can we help you get around that and it’s not telling people what to do or how to do they actually know how the what and the how they need more perspective to choose what action they’re going to Take. And Mentors just by sheer Nature. We’re we’re sharing our experience hey I ran into that same tree I can’t believe it’s still in the road Now. Ah you know, but I ran into it and and here’s how here’s how I got around it now I scraped my knee I cut my hand you know, but I dig it around. It.

10:28.84 podcomm Ah.

10:39.56 jayne heggen Um, and just sharing what you did that worked and didn’t work with the person for them to say Okay, how does that apply to what I’m doing now does it apply. It may not apply. But now you start a conversation of possibilities and when you get into possibilities.

10:47.82 podcomm Um.

10:58.53 jayne heggen You get to solutions because you can make choices.

11:02.91 podcomm Um I like that you point out like the idea of the I’m trying to think of the. Woman from the wizard of Oz Dorothy had the power. You know the power Dorothy has the power and she’s looking for people to solve her problems of it in the end. It’s like you already had the power just click your heels and I think that’s a ah, wonderful way to to look at how mentorship works and I’m thinking about.

11:15.79 jayne heggen Um, dorothy.

11:34.82 podcomm So if you’re creating a podcast and you capture that conversation with somebody who was a mentor just for example and then you go back to Geekville and you plug this into your you know audio workstation and you start editing it. It’s a very special opportunity for you to.

11:40.60 jayne heggen Um.

11:54.20 podcomm Like focus What the mentor would normally have done like if a mentor is having a session or or a lunchnge… Whatever and they’re telling your story and they’re sharing their experience. They can’t go like oh wait I could do that paragraph better I Mean. Maybe they can but it wrecks it like they they have to just sort of deliver it literally authentically because that’s who they are and I’m wondering how and and I’m hoping that this isn’t a new idea because I will have given you another Rep. We’ll have given you another rabbit hole but have you have you realized that your your editing.

12:09.19 jayne heggen Yeah, so.

12:28.33 podcomm In the good Sense. You’re editing what the mentors are doing and Sharing. You’re helping them improve their storytelling after the fact and if you if you’re aware of that and you’re going into that rabbit hole. How do you know when to stop like how do you know when you have done enough improvement or. Maybe you shouldn’t do any improvement in this particular case like how do you?? How do you meta that process.

12:49.21 jayne heggen My initial thoughts and I’m in the process now is their story is their story that they’re telling their experience is their experience I can help to guide it honestly by by listening to their story. To keep us on track and when it goes off track. You know it’s okay because there’s usually when you go off track. There’s some little thing somewhere that pulled you off track and it wants to come up and I’m all for and a lot of people say hey you got to control the podcast control. The. But yeah I mean I don’t want it to go into weird space. But if there’s something that’s trying to get out I’ll let it run I’ll let it run because I can add out the other stuff because when that little thing pops Up. It’s going to be magical. It is going to be you know something that goes whoa. That is so cool man you know and I’m hoping that when these stories are put out people who are maybe looking for a mentor or looking just to hear the stories of mentors would go Wow. You know that’s that’s something like ah something I’m dealing with right now. That’s such a good story I can relate to that story that that helps me see other things. Ah yeah, That’s the the goal I don’t know how close I’ll come to that goal but the stories have to be what they are. My job is to make sure their voices as good as it. Possibly can be so they’ll tell more stories.

14:29.97 podcomm Do you find that mentors that you’re approaching are they open to being recorded like is that a common I’m guessing that having the the experiences that 1 is sharing as a mentor having that be recorded is not a particularly common thing I don’t. I Would guess most Mentees don’t show up and like tape record their mentor please or give me the gems. Um, So do you find that the the mentors are sort of surprised by it or or are they more surprised about at how much they enjoy the process I’m just wondering if you have any insights to how this experience of podcasting being on a podcast. Is surprising for the mentors.

15:09.97 jayne heggen 2 things. Um 1 Typically the stories and not going to say I shouldn’t say typically of what I’ve seen of a other podcast that focus on Mentoring. It really is about how mentoring changed my life. You know, um and indeed a good mentoring relationship. Can. Help because it helps you see things you couldn’t see for yourself. Um, you know or they get very skill based um, very tactical I haven’t seen a podcast yet where a mentor basically tells a story of an experience and. It doesn’t have to be a mentor relationship relationship because here’s what happens after a while you get enough experience. You can’t help yourself. You become a mentor you start sharing stories experiences. You don’t even sometimes realizing you’re mentoring because you’re trying to help somebody say hey. I Went down this path before too and here’s what happened to me, let me share that with you So you’ve got people who are truly mentors I know that they volunteered for it mostly every mentor I know Volunteers I think they all should be paid. But that’s another story. Ah, ah and you got people who are doing.

16:18.70 podcomm Ah.

16:25.37 jayne heggen Sharing this work and not even realizing it and actually those are some of the most powerful stories because it it’s it’s you know it’s um that the the little girl and I have 1 of yeah who had a disability became ah this championship ice skater. And I focused in on her skating I didn’t focus on the books her present the things she does now were training and speaking and all these other stuff. So What happened what happened there and how that little girl took that moment of becoming a championship ice skater and then. That became a way for her to look at obstacles and for me to now help her look at this is how we make choices. We look at these things we examine these things and when we have these things we can make a better choice for ourselves for our life our work or wherever we’re going. So I can wrap some of that around it but it was that experience she found this aha moment where she had a tree given to her that fell on top of her and she had to crawl out from under that tree or get around that tree on her own to get where she is. That’s a mentoring experience. Story.

17:43.33 podcomm What do you hope that? um people will take away from so there’s like podcasting gives at multiple levels right? like you, you put a show out in the world and the show itself might be inspiring. It might inspire somebody to become a mentor or to find they realize that they need a mentor. But um, are you aware or are you thinking about what people might take away from the show in terms of podcasting. So like if you’re putting this in the men in ah in a space of podcasts about mentoring. But you’re coming at it from a slightly different point of view. Are you hoping? Do you think that other people will will see what you’re doing as a podcaster and maybe take away a lesson from that of like oh maybe I can do a slightly different thing in my you know like Craig’s niche of podcasting is not around mentoring. Um, so I’m I’m wondering you’re could ask like you’re kind of almost mentoring other podcasters by showing how you do things but it’s a little bit podcasting is a little bit of like a sleight of hand It’s kind of a little hard sometimes to see what the podcaster really did. Um, but if you do it over and over you can kind of pick up on Janey’s style you can pick up on hygieni does things how she picks guests I’m just wondering if you’ve put any thought into are you attempting? or maybe you’re doing it not realizing it to be a mentor through how you are podcasting.

18:57.13 jayne heggen Um, yeah.

19:09.74 jayne heggen I’m not really worried about it. Um for a couple of reasons but I’ll reflect into the business I’ve been doing in addition to to mentoring big mentoring’s been my side gig for 20 years my main business is business process reengineering I realign. Companies corporations and I always do it with people in mind. So that’s a twist right? there the work I do I give to everyone you can look at any of ah my work I don’t hide anything is process work. Anybody can do process work but no 1 does the work I do because they don’t have my experience. They don’t have my knowledge. They don’t have my superpowers. They have other superpowers so you can’t replicate what I do you might pull the methodology forward, but that’s like hey reading a great book and deciding now that I can now take the graphs in this book and now apply it to what I’m doing I’m going to have the same result doesn’t work that way.

20:02.80 podcomm Ah.

20:04.41 jayne heggen Ah, so if it’s inspiring. That’s great if an engagement happens out of it and we end up talking and exploring great if someone wants to learn how to become a mentor great. You’re gonna then then then you and I will then go into a different engagement.

20:20.46 podcomm Arrive.

20:23.81 jayne heggen Ah, so but if if I’m being authentic if I’m really telling my story the best way I know how to tell my story. No 1 else can tell that story.

20:36.98 podcomm Terrific as much as I hate to say it. That’s probably where we should stop for today though I didn’t get you off you stopped talking? No, it’s all good. Ah so as I said at the beginning thanks for taking the time to chat.

20:40.52 jayne heggen No, you’re not gonna cut me off No ah okay, no thank you.

20:54.90 podcomm So it’s interesting to see how people are doing what they do and what drives them. So thanks so much cheney.

20:58.95 jayne heggen Thank you I Really appreciate the conversation as well.

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